A little over a month ago, I planted a couple tomato plants. Our tomato cages got lost in our move last year, so I put the tomato plants in the ground and figured I would go get new cages in a couple days, before they could grow too much. (A tomato cage is metal cage that goes around the tomato plant. It provides support for the tomato as it grows and bears fruit.) And then . . . I didn’t get the cages. I would be out watering my garden and think, Oh, those plants are getting kind of big. I should go get cages. Then I would go inside and the tomato cages would slip my mind. Every time I watered the garden, I would remember that I needed to get tomato cages—but there was no rush, right?
A couple weeks ago, I noticed some little baby tomatoes starting to grow. The tomatoes are going to weigh the plant down. I thought. I better get some cages. Just in case I might forget again, I grabbed some sticks that had fallen from the tree during our last storm and used those to try to shore up the tomato plants a little. Why didn’t I think to do this when I first planted them? I wondered. And then I forgot about tomato cages.
This past week, I realized that the pepper plant next to one of the tomatoes plants was completely overshadowed because the tomato plant had flopped over a bit. I reminded myself, I better get tomato cages pretty soon, and I added another stick, just in case.
A few days ago I finally got tomato cages. Installing tomato cages over plants that are big enough to be growing fruit isn’t easy. The plants had already started slanting in directions I didn’t want them to grow. In trying to pull parts of the plants through the holes in the cages, I managed to break branches in a couple spots. So now one of my tomato plants is recovering from wounds. One branch is completely gone; the blossoms it had grown will never bear fruit. I went slowly, though, and with patience and effort, my tomato plants are now safely supported—just like they should have been from the beginning. I will have beautiful tomatoes, even though my yield will be slightly less because of the branch I broke off.
A wise gardener would have installed the tomato cages immediately upon planting, just to be sure the support was in place before it was even needed. Waiting too long to install the cages made the work difficult and caused some damage. However, what grows from here on should be healthy and supported.
~~~
Many of us do in our marriages what I did with my tomato cages.
We marry, convinced that love will be enough to get us through anything. The marriage grows, and we may recognize that it needs some help—but we forget or we just don’t get around to it. Over time, married life gets heavier and more difficult. Because we didn’t have good support from the beginning, the marriage becomes a little lopsided and out of control. We may try to shore it up with temporary measures, but they just aren’t enough. The fruit of our lack of effort starts to weigh things down. It starts to overshadow other things we try to nurture in our lives, just like my forlorn little pepper plant.
A wise couple installs support from the beginning of the marriage, being intentional about putting in place the counsel and resources that will help the marriage grow and thrive.
My husband and I were not wise. We waited so long to work on our marriage that the work was sometimes difficult and caused some emotional bruising. However, we continue to heal. What grows from here on will be healthy and supported.
If you have been married a long while, the prospect of healing your marriage may seem overwhelming. You can’t go back and start over, and you wonder if there is any point in trying. What good will it do? you think. The damage has already been done.
It is not too late.
You cannot go back and get a do-over on the early years in your marriage, but you can start where you are right now. There may be some bruising and it probably won’t be easy, but seek support now to help redirect your growth.
It is not too late. You still have time for good fruit to grow.
Image credit | Chris Taylor
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My husband has told me that it is too late for our marriage and he wants out. I have done too much damage and he will never trust me.
I will never give up hope.
I am sorry. I imagine that is a hard thing to hear. Your husband must be hurting very much. I’m sure you are, too. It takes time and effort to rebuild a husband’s trust. There is no guarantee, of course, but you can always start right where you are and see what you can do. Begin with praying for his heart to heal. Hope is a good thing to have.
Very very difficult to hear. Especially when he still seeks me out for his physical needs to be met and I give in with high hopes that this will help. It it never does, and i become further crushed.
I can start today in prayer that my husbands heart will soften and that I can detach from the choices he makes for himself. I must learn to respect that he doesnt want to stay married and respect that he doesnt want to work on our marriage. Right now he views me as the evil one.
I continue to stay in the hope of what God can do for our marriage. And at rhe same time I have to be realistic and prepare myself for what could possibly lie ahead.
When you think of it as giving in (as I did for many years), it is hard to get past the expectation and hope that that one time will make a difference. Is there something you can work on in yourself to reframe this not as giving in but as loving? Each time you view it as giving in, it probably shows–and even though it gives your husband a physical release, it may add to the emotional barrier he has against you. If you view each time as loving him, it helps to eat away at that wall a little bit.
If he is continuing to seek you out for physical release, there is hope. In fact, read this post at The Generous Husband. In particular, note this part:
Read this carefully, and think about what it might say about your husband’s heart.
I am pragmatic enough to say that it makes good sense to prepare for the worst and hope for the best–but I think you also need to actively strive for the best that you’re hoping for.
Thanks so much. My husband use to say that when we were sexual, he would feel like his world was okay. I didnt understand that, but I sure do now. Even though I feel used, especially after an hour before,, he tells me how much he cant stand me and cant stand being around me, I still have a hope dance going on in my heart and the day is much better.
I have been led to beleive that the sexual act for a man is all physical and for a woman all emotional, so what I am reading here is really opening my eyes.
I am preparing for the worst..and I can still actively hope for the best..I like that thought. I am also learning how to detach from him as he is very moody and takes his anger out on me. I pray that he gets help and that the Holy Spirit is given space to get in his heart and work on my husband.
I’m sorry you are feeling used. I know that can feel rotten. Continue to work on your marriage and on any areas where you personally need to grow. Have you read the book Boundaries (that’s an affiliate link), by Cloud and Townsend? It might help you develop healthy responses to your husband’s mood and anger.
At the risk of sounding (or maybe actually being) simplistic, I know that some, maybe lots, maybe all, men can be very moody and angry when the sexual connection in marriage shuts down.
That doesn’t mean that having sex together is going to fix that, but not having sex is likely to make it worse.
Prayers & best wishes.
This is such a hard topic and such a hard work.
One partner wants to rebuild – the other goes slower, doesn’t really trust their partner.
Friendship and warmth on both sides have grown cold over years or decades. There are many counter-productive habits and expectations.
The other partner may come around and accept the first partner’s bid, but the first partner now is frustrated, discouraged or feels “done.”
They may not agree on what needs work first. They may not agree on how to start the project of rebuilding a love grown cold. One may desperately want the structure of counseling, but the other doesn’t trust the process. One may suggest a book, but the tone or emphasis turns the other partner off.
They know they need to work to save their marriage, but can’t agree on how, what, when…
Marriage needs work. Some marriages are just hard work. Trying to recreate a marriage after decades of neglect and the growth of “bad habits” is really tough work. Please let this be a word to the wise. As we used to tell our boys when they were young, please “put on your listening ears.”
I believe that even without agreement about what work needs to be done, individual effort can be enough over time. If one spouse doesn’t trust counseling, the other spouse can go for support on working through his or her own issues. Get mentally healthy and strong, and address areas where growth is needed. Meanwhile, the other spouse can be reading and applying new knowledge. I worked on our marriage for several years before my husband believed that I was was serious about making changes–and then he got on board with me. We had both agreed long ago that our marriage needed work, but we didn’t agree on what needed to be done. The problem wasn’t that we didn’t agree, but that because we didn’t agree, neither of us did anything about it.
You are so right. My husband and I had been struggling for several years. At one point I started going to counseling on my own. Sometimes he came but mainly it was just me. It did help and the counselor helped be see that he needed me to truly cherish and value him. Last year at this time I would never have believed our marriage could be what it is now. … Love never looses hope, endures through every circumstance…
Every couple is different (I was going to say “probably” but I don’t think there’s doubt).
In one case that I’m close to, I think the biggest thing is one or both of the partners triggering each other’s “stubborn gene” – refusal to be a (the) quitter. 😉
As I was typing the reply above I looked to the right and saw this, which resonates in my heart:
Make me a clean heart, O God: and renew a right spirit within me. ~ Psalm 51:10
God help us all…that’s a prayer, not just a toss-away phrase.
I am a man who can attest that sex is more mental and emotional than physical.
I have read many times about physical discomfort or pain etc and needing a release many me. Get. I’m not sure I have really ever felt pain down there from lack of release. Sure I got “horny” etc. but for me it was always about the connection and lack of, and need for, connection. That is why I sought so desparately for sexual experience with my wife. If I simply wanted/needed physical release, well that I could do virtually anytime I wanted with my hand. Yet that always leaves me feeling guilty and empty. Sort of like I guess how going out and getting drunk to relieve the stress of some sort. Sure it feels good in The moment, but the moment he high wears off, the issue that you were trying to drown with alcohol still remains. Same is true with masterbation. When you’re done, you still have the same problem of lack of connection. The physical portion was met. but the more important emotional connection is still lacking.
Therefore I believe there can still be hope if the husband is still seeking sex with his wife. It is both physical to some extent, but it is his only last hope that he can attain or regain emotional connection with his wife. It is literally the match that he is striking to see if he can rekindle a fire.
I also agree that it is almost certain that if a wife goes into sex with a feeling of obligation, duty or “giving in”, the husband will almost certainly sense and “know” this. Which is absolutely crushing to a man who loves his wife (or for those in the opposite situation).
Many men sex is so connecting, that he believes if his wife cannot connect with sex and how physically pleasurable and connecting that is, if she doesn’t connect during sex, well then “it is done”. That there is no hope. Now that may not be how many, of not most women feel related to sex. But I think that is what many, if not most men feel and believe. So if he gets repeatedly the sense that his wife is just giving in and doing it out of obligation or duty or a chore. He is crushed to the core and cannot believe his wife really wants to be with him. The fact he keeps coming back, tells me he is trying again and again to rekindle. Or I guess the other possibility is that he is in fact selfish and only seeking physical pleasure. But I don’t think that is generally the case.
I don’t mean this at all to be critical. I just wanted to offer one mans view of how important and emotionally connecting sex is to many men and how they may view obligation sex by their wife. And how hurtful that is to the husband. It is BY FAR the worst thing in my life. To not feel wanted sexually by my wife. NOTHING even comes close second place to that pain.
At least that is my experience.
There is one question I never seem to get an honest answer from any woman.
Why is sex not a priority to a wife in a marriage, but the thought of the husband having his physical needs satisfied elsewhere is met with horror.
Can any lady/wife give me an honest answer?
For me, it was about one thing: I wanted to be more important to my husband than sex was.
I didn’t understand the biological or emotional needs that sex filled in my husband, so I thought he was only after an orgasm. I wanted him to want me, not an orgasm.
This is a completely honest answer.
Chris, thanks for your reply. And I just wanted to say you have a wonderful site and please continue doing the work you are doing. I just wish wives were concerned enough about their marriages to troll the internet and find sites such as this.
Coming back to your reply. Firstly, lets for a moment pretend that it truly was about ‘the orgasm’, which we know is not so, is that really so bad. An orgasm lasts a few seconds. It takes me longer to make my wife a cup of hot chocolate. It takes me longer to carry the garbage out. It takes me longer to wait for her while she shops for a pair of shoes, etc. Does it not occur to wives if that was all the man wanted he could simply masturbate and would not need his wife to have an orgasm.
Secondly are wives simply not able to comprehend that men and women have different needs in a relationship. If she would need him for conversation, security, compassion etc etc, are his unique needs not considered. I struggle to believe woman are ignorant to the fact that the two sexes are very different. But if they do understand this is it not then a case of selfishness. I want what I need but do not want to give him what he needs.
Then thirdly, why in 9 out of 10 marriages does the wife start out thrilled with the intimacy side of the relationship and after a year or two decides that sex is no longer necessary. Then when the relationship starts deteriorating she simply cannot connect the dots.
Please don’t see my reply as being critical. I truly would like to understand from a woman’s perspective.
Nope. I thought my husband’s desire for me (as opposed to his hand) was a combination of laziness and thinking that I belonged in the role of serving him. I didn’t realize that serving my husband could be an act of love. Instead, I thought of it as the next stop before being turned into a Stepford wife doormat. And, because I really thought it was about the orgasm, I just didn’t get it. Honestly, there are times those thoughts still pop up in my head.
Able? Yes. But do we? Not always. Then again, I could turn it around and ask if husbands are not able to comprehend the same thing. Many husbands judge a sexual encounter’s success by whether she has an orgasm. When wives say they don’t want one, or when they struggle, their husbands often push and pressure. Then the orgasm feels more like an obligation, and sex feels like it’s for what he wants instead of for her at all.
Then again, maybe men’s and women’s needs aren’t that different. We all need intimacy. We need to be fully known, loved, and accepted. The differences come about in how we best experience those things.
Where do you come up with the 9 out of 10? I’m not sure about that number, although I know that this does happen somewhat frequently. I can think of several reasons. I’m sure there are more.
Maybe the reason wives are horrified at the thought of husbands having their needs met elsewhere is that this confirms our fears: All he wants/needs is sex. He doesn’t want/need me.
I’m still a little confused, IntimacySeeker. I only need sex once a week, maybe sometimes twice. At roughly half an hour per session that’s 1 to 2 hours a week. Her needs from me easily equal that per day! So firstly I am on the short end of the stick and secondly my other needs from her far outweigh the sex need. These needs she dispenses with a smile.
I should have phrased that differently: “his need for sex is separate from, and is more significant and powerful than, his need for me.”
I too have come to realize, after 22 years of marriage, that the physical aspect of sex, though important and certainly fulfilling, pales in comparison to the emotional and relational fulfillment and sense of well-being sex with my wife provides. When meaningful sex is absent, occurs infrequently, is hurried (i.e., “just do your thing”) or treated as a chore, multiple needs remain unmet. It’s frankly a turn off and leads me down a path that leaves me feeling empty, questioning my wife’s love for me, questioning my very manhood, frankly.
As for the main issue here -can it be too late, I am a man of Christian faith, so I cannot ignore hope, perseverance and restoration. The bible teaches us the importance of them. However, I do feel that where a spouse faces years of the other’s refusal to address or even work on or discuss lack of intimacy, desire, infrequent sex and the refusal to simply meet her spouse’s emotional needs — and that refusal becomes clearly established (i.e., you know that you know that you know it will not change due to your history and in speaking with her, not just once), to stay in that type of relationship is akin to subjecting yourself to emotional abuse.
It’s at that point where I find myself. With three kids and a wife (whom I do love) who does not show me intimacy (physical or otherwise), has sex very infrequently and begrudgingly, and who now answers my question Do you love me with, “I know I’m supposed to say, Yes;” and with the help of a Christian counselor to process these things, I have to put my foot down and say “enough.”
So, I would have to say, although I never thought it would happen to me, although I always thought I should and could be patient and persevere, although I always perceived myself as being capable of sacrificing, I have come to realize it can be too late when your spouse won’t even come to the table to acknowledge the problem(s) and address and work through (with him or a counselor) what her spouse vulnerably and in love discloses are ways she is not meeting basic emotional needs.
It almost sounds counter-Christian to me to write these things. God does hate divorce. God hates sin, too; and as spouses we are duty bound to love our spouses (I Cor. 7:3-5; Eph 5:33) and not emotionally abuse them. As most things are a matter of the heart, do we not realize that God sees our hearts and the disconnect when situations like this persist? What results is an emotional divorce that exists–causing pain and distance to both parties.
So, unfortunately I do think it can be too late sometimes in a marriage. To overcome that requires the acknowledgment and effort of both spouses to acknowledge, address, discuss and work on fixing the problems.
It is never too late to try, and if both spouses are making the effort, it is never to late to heal. One spouse’s effort truly can change the marriage. Unfortunately, “can” is not “will.”
Divorce can be messy and is often painful. It affects more than just the two people who are uncoupling. However, sometimes a divorce is just a legal acknowledgement of what happened in the relationship long ago. Have you told your wife where you are in your marriage? Even if a husband has told her for years about how much the lack of intimacy hurts and how sex is a major problem, a wife can be shocked when her husband files for divorce. If that is your intention, please tell her that–and give her one more chance to save the marriage.
I just want to chime in here to echo and reinforce the question “[h]ave you told your [spouse] where you are…?” My wife and I have been having a very rough road for the last 6+ months trying to grapple with a much longer period of parallel (i.e., disconnected) living than Chris and her husband had. I thought I had been clear for months that we were either going to have a new marriage or we were going to recognize that we had no marriage and get divorced as a recognition of that fact. Well, it turned out that although *I* thought I’d been clear, what I (thought I) was saying to my wife was not clear. Please, people, do not put yourselves in *that* position! It isn’t productive and it isn’t fair…
Yes. See my post below. I have been extremely candid with my wife about my intentions and “next steps”. Inasmuch as she has refused to progress, seek counseling or join me in couples counseling, I have raised the idea bout separation for months. She is now aware that I am speaking with the counselor about separation and what that looks like and how that would work, good and bad.
I sincerely wonder, however, if she is not secretly relieved that I am pursuing that path. I can’t know for sure, because it takes 2 people to have a discussion. But I wonder.
She may well be relieved that you are pursuing separation–not because she is happy about ending the marriage but because she needs a break from constant tension. I sometimes think that a big part of what helped me change was that my husband was experiencing mild depression related to unemployment (it was all right in the middle of the recession). He wasn’t pursuing me for sex as much. Without the constant need to protect myself against sexual advances, I was able to let my guard down enough to be able to think about healing and not see him so much as the enemy.
I couldn’t agree more. Divorce is not a good solution — it may ultimately resolve the problems and memorialize what has actually happened during the marriage (extreme separation). I would not jump (and didn’t intend to imply, in my prior post today, that I would) into a divorce until I feel all efforts had been made to restore the marriage.
In addition, I think it is selfish for a spouse not to let the other (even if she is the “offender”) know exactly where you are in your mind or in your decision-making or relationship-rebuilding attempts/process. You must both be candid (I would say ‘brutally’ so, but I think we must be kindhearted about it). So, I have kept my wife apprised of exactly what’s going through my head, candidly, to try to work together to restore a relationship, I have sought Christian counseling alone (she will not go with me or go alone), and I am considering what separation looks like and might accomplish — which I know is fraught with its own perils.
My overarching feeling about all this is that I don’t want anything about my intentions concerning our marriage or relationship to come to her as a surprise (i.e., “surprise; here are your divorce papers”). After 25 years in a relationship (23 married), I owe that to her, and I do love her. And, if I truly want restoration, she has to have the knowledge of how I feel and where I am coming from to equip her to take action herself to join me in that effort. That said, she has to move toward me, not stand still or move backward.
As for one spouse being able to effectuate change, I agree — but ultimately I see it all dependent upon the other spouse to acknowledge the issues, help plan resolution and work toward resolution, even if uncomfortable, even if having to involve a third-party. For me, I’ve not been able to instill that type of desire in my wife, it seems though I have (perhaps sometimes in too dogged a way) tried, picked at the scab, started the hard discussions — especially over the past 8 mos., but also stemming back over 20 years. The response I get is that she doesn’t know me, we don’t connect, all I care about is sex, she can’t say without hesitation that she loves me or wants me, and despite my pleading and attempts to get usboth to work on things, there is no regular intimacy – not just sex, but what I would see as “base-level,” marital intimacy (physical touch of any kind, praying outloud with me for our marriage, affection, appreciation and affirmation, acknowledgment of responsibility and a desire to work together to combat evil and change the situation).
After years and pleading and attempts to effectuate change, hope diminishes.
Chris wrote: “Many husbands judge a sexual encounter’s success by whether she has an orgasm.” I wonder if many husbands equate orgasm with connection. When he says he wants her to show up, to bring her heart and soul to the experience, etc., etc., etc., her orgasm is proof to him that she feels as emotionally connected as he feels by the sexual experience.
Hmmm…that’s an interesting idea. If orgasm is the moment when he feels most connected to her, then her willingness to forego the orgasm (because she is feeling connected by other aspects of the encounter) is viewed as her lack of desire to feel connected. You just might be on to something here.
I think that is absolutely true. I see it as my wife’s being completely vulnerable, giving 100% of herself to me – not in a selfish way for me, but that she has given her soul and body, without holding back, to be with me and enjoy me. Then, there is another part that I think husbands consider that is more about masculinity – “I, man and husband, have caused my wife to be deeply pleased,” that goes to the heart of a man’s self esteem. I relate to Chris’ comment completely
I may have to write a post about this idea . . .
I have read similar comments from other husbands. I wonder how many wives feel that their orgasms = giving 100% of themselves or being deeply pleased.
Chris,
Last year you wrote a post telling your readers that they shouldn’t expect their husbands’ sexuality to be like a woman’s sexuality. I’m thinking that, for this situation, the shoe is on the other foot. Since through orgasm, with its rush of oxytocin, etc., men feel bonded, I think it quite likely that they are operating from the same template, expecting/hoping that their wives will experience the same bonding and elation that they do.
I know, having read on so many different websites, that women don’t crave/need orgasm every single time. It makes no sense, but hey, fifty million Frenchman, erm, women can’t be wrong, right?
Wives need to make men understand that while orgasm doesn’t do the same thing to them as to the hubses, they still do enjoy the physical intimacy.
Sometimes this is easier said than done. When a wife has a history of avoiding sex or not wanting to be fully engaged in sexual activity, “I am enjoying this but don’t want an orgasm tonight” can be perceived by a formerly refused husband as an indication that things are going back to the way they were.
When we understand ourselves and assume the best of our spouses, it is easier to teach each other about our sexuality.
I think that most of us think that your bodies and minds work like ours (!!!). You and we need to talk and understand each other better. 🙂 We are also very task-oriented, and think that making sure you have an orgasm is something we’re supposed to do, a mark of success or failure. We need to talk to each other more. 🙂
More thoughts on connection. I would say that over time, with the growth and healing of our relationship and more frequent sex, my husband and I are more in tune with one another on the whole. This has been a process over a few years now. But I’ve never experienced what Julie Siebert at http://intimacyinmarriage.com describes as “soul drenching connection” with an orgasm. I may be atypical in this regard, but I imagine this description fits what many men experience and hope/assume their wives experience as well.